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We (Kristi, Christiana, Brandon, and I) just had the opportunity to take some pre-prom pictures with Ariel and Nathan before they left for their big evening. Click the ‘more’ link just below to see the gallery. I am hoping to add more pictures as they are sent. Enjoy!
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Last week, Christiana, Brandon, Kristi, and Kevin went on a long awaited trip to the magic kingdom. After spending 24 hours in the park (in 2 days) we went on all but 4 rides. The kids had a blast and we were all wore out from the trip that started on Tuesday and ended on Friday. Brandon and Christiana both said their favorite ride was Indiana Jones.
There are a ton of pictures so click here to go to the next page and see them.
Continue reading…
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Christiana and Ariel both mentioned that this may have been their best Christmas ever. An abundance of love and family activities made the time quite special. In the pictures below, you will see Kristi, Christiana, Brandon, Ariel, Mom, Dad, Toni, and Gary. There were a lot of other activities this Christmas season that were not captured on film; but, will surely survive eternally in our memories. Enjoy!
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After a nightmare of treatment with CP and having to move the tank to a new location, this tank has been reborn as a rapidly developing reef community. However, with just over a year in the marine aquarium hobby, I have learned the importance of patience … and learned it the hard way. To date, the tank is home to the following:
Fish
Inverts
This tank still has a refugium with DSB and 24 hour lighting in the sump. The sump is home to Cheato algae but no other intentional marine life. I hope to add some refugium pets in the near future.
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Last week, Kristi, Christiana, Brandon, and me took a trip to Williams, AZ to experience the Grand Canyon Railway’s version of the Polar Express. Rather than write a lengthy review of our wonderful experience, we will let the pictures speak for themselves:
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Hi Bob –
Following up and asking for your assistance again:
I have completed the process following your instructions. I ran the skimmer and poly filter for about 3 weeks following the final treatment.
During the course of treatment, I lost numerous fish and my shrimps for unknown reasons. I also lost some coral due to the quarantine cycle process. However, I stayed on course.
I put the my surviving coral (from my QT) back into the main DT after the 3 week polyfilter period. Also, I have slowly added MH lighting at 1 hour per day … leaving the actinic on for about 14 hours each day so as not to shock the coral. Now, most of the corals, including 2 bubbles, a frogspawn, open brain, plate coral, and several others have died within a few days. Just seemed to melt and slime away. Should I also be running activated carbon? Any ideas on the most likely cause of death?
Continue reading…
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Saturday brought the urge to get out and explore a bit. So, Melissa, Brandon, Christiana, David, Betty, Brittany, and myself went on a one-day road trip. Ariel did not want to join us so she made other plans.
Christiana and Brittany decided they wanted to go to a princess castle. So, we set out for the next best thing … Scotty’s Castle in Death Valley. We drove North on 95 through Beatty and entered Death Valley that way. Then, we went to Scotty’s Castle and down through Death Valley. We made a couple of stops and headed out through Pahrump. The kids were exhausted but had a great time.
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The Volitans Lionfish and our new friend have expired, less than a week after Smiley, a Porcupine Puffer, was added to the tank. Hard lesson reinforcing the need for quarantine.
This tank is currently fallow and being treated with Chloroquine Phosphate concurrent with the treatment of the 300 Gallon Reef.
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These images show the symbiotic relationship between the Haddoni Carpet Anemone and the Oscellaris Clownfish. The relationship took approximately 2 minutes to form, once the Anemone was introduced into the tank. My initial plan was to add some more clownfish. However, I have decided to leave these 2 alone. Nemo now jumps out of the water at my arm to protect the Anemone when I go to feed him. A bit more agressive than usual … <grin>.
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Coral and fish seem to be happy and healthy! These pictures were taken about a week before the parasitic infection was noticed in the predatory reef tank that the Powder Blue Tang was transferred from.
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In researching the best possible treatment for the tanks parasitic infestation, Bob Goemans has been kind enough to offer his advice to my specific situation:
My text is below and his suggestions are in blue:
Hi Bob -
Thank you for your quick response. I am treating my 300 gallon reef for ich. I cannot catch all of the fish as some of them scurry through the sand when I try. So, I am quarantining the invertebrates and treating the DT. I have the book referenced below and am prepared, with the powder, to treat at 40mg/gallon (12 grams for the 300 Gallon Tank) for 10 days. My questions are primarily related to what to do at the end of 10 days, such as using water changes and/or carbon to remove the chemical. And, how soon may I add the coral back?
Thanks again for your great efforts in the hobby!
- Kevin
Hi Kevin,
There is a treatment mentioned in the book that has allowed leaving the inverts in the aquarium. Have you read that?
As for treatment, maintain proper specific gravity (1.024 – 26) and recommend an initial 20 mg/l, so that’s twice the amount you’re planning on. Thereafter, a 10mg/l dosage every 7 – 10 days for the next three treatments. (total of 4 treatments) Of course, during treatment, any phosphate removing product (CP will kill-off any algae) should be discontinued, as should activated carbon and/or ozone and skimming/UV. Once treatments are concluded, those products/devices and/or Poly-Filters can be used as needed.
As for water changes, a small change (20 gallons in your size aqu.) between each additional treatment is thought helpful, and also at the end of treatment. Otherwise, CP will be removed by the media mentioned above.
Keep me informed, and what city do you live in, as I’m tracking all CP data.
Hope this helps,
Bob
I am in Las Vegas, Nevada.
I have already quarantined my coral and all of the snails and crabs that I could catch. Surely, there is quite a bit more in the rock and sand. I am hoping that I will not have a toxic ammonia issue based on the dye off.
The method you are referring to in the book is about using the CP in food, right? If so, I did consider this but decided to treat the entire tank. I am actually treating 2 tanks, the 300G and a 60G that was the initial breeding ground. The 60 gallon tank is fallow, as well. (I moved a Powder Blue Tang from the 60 to the 300 and a week later lost my Volitans Lion and Porcupine Puffer to ich from the 60G Tank. Then, surprise, it showed up fierce in the 300 Gallon tank).
I have treated using the 10mg/l dose recommended in the book and was under the impression that this was the best method. Based on your suggestion below, would you recommend that I purchase more and increase the dose? Does your current data indicate that I will have issues with die-off from my live rock and sand?
Hi Kevin,
Lost Wages! You’re right next door to me here in Tucson. Post away, as helping others is what I’m about! What’s your blog?
Yes, the treat food method does work as on-going data has shown, but in some ways its more time consuming to apply.
And yes, following data has shown its best to up the initial treatment level.
Also, crustaceans don’t seem to be effected by CP, nor does the bacteria in the sandbed. That’s why its so much better than copper.
If more CP is needed, try:
Fishman Chemicals
David Fishman, president
215 Ojibway Ave.
Tavernier, FL 33070
ph: (305) 852-6121
fax: (305) 852-6272
David’s email:
sales@fishchemicals.com
Website:
www.fishchemical.com
He only sells wholesale, so maybe a local shop will have to purchase it for you.
Hope this helps,
Bob
As such, I have changed course and will be following these suggestions. More to come!
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Subject: Chloroquine Phosphate and treating Display Tank
(WWM Comments in Blue)
Hi Bob and Crew -
<Kevin>
I spend at least 8-10 hours per week reading on your site and absolutely love and appreciate all of the great advice. I have only been in the hobby for about 6 months and already have a 300 Gallon Reef, a 60 Gallon FOWLR, and a 34 Gallon Species with a Carpet Anemone and one False Percula. You helped me identify a Nudibranch about a month ago and I have since invested in another 30 gallon tank for quarantine and treatment.
However, like many of your readers, I was devastatingly delinquent in adding the quarantine tank. So, today I write you regarding my 300 Gallon Reef System. I have spend many hours reading on your site about Crypto and other parasites and have recently added a Powder Blue Tang from my 60 Gallon to the 300 Gallon reef system. A week later, I lost my Puffer and Volitans Lion in the 60 gallon tank to Ich. Now, the Powder Blue Tang is showing signs of Ich and has evidently spread the love. My 5″ Foxface Lo is also exhibiting signs of ‘Black Ich’.
<This, as you likely are aware, is not “that” deleterious>
I know that the drill is to capture and treat all of the fish. This is not possible in this tank. Even if I were to remove all the rock, many of the fishes would hide in the substrate,
<Mmm, they can be sand-sifted out>
etc. However, last night I ran across a post where I inferred that treating the display tank is better than nothing at all. I am afraid that this will be my only option. So, my plan is as follows:
1) Remove all of my Coral and place in a large quarantine tank
2) I have ordered Chloroquine Phosphate based on recommendation by WWM and the book “The Marine Fish Health & Feeding Handbook” This is truly the least lethal medication for the fish and the best for a display, right?
<Currently likely the most useful for Protozoans, including Amyloodinium>
3) I will remove as many of my snails and crabs as possible
<Mmm… this antimalarial (Aralen) is quite toxic to a range of invertebrates… and there are, assuredly, a huge mix of these in and about your rock, substrate… These may be killed (along with any algae), resulting in a toxic cascade effect… Again, it would be much BETTER to remove the fishes, treat them elsewhere>
4) I will treat the display tank for 10 days with 40mg per gallon of Chloroquine Phosphate
My question is, at the end of this treatment, assuming all of the fish look fine:
1) How long do I wait to add the coral and inverts back
<Three weeks or so>
2) Do I change 50% water and add carbon to rid the Chloroquine? Is this sufficient?
<Activated carbon and Polyfilter should do it>
3) I believe that I have read in several places that the necessary bacteria should not be affected by this treatment, is this still your experience?
<Yes… however… the above reference…>
Is there anything that I have overlooked that may cause me problems either immediately; or, long term?
<Turn off your skimmer, and UV, remove any other chemical filtrants…>
Thank you very much for all of your help!
- Kevin
<Welcome. Bob Fenner>
I left out my water parameters, etc:
Ammonia 0
Nitrite 0
Nitrate less than 5
SG 1.027
PH 8.3
<These are fine. I’d like to add the possibility of your delivering the CP via foods… One formula calls for 3.7 grams of CP dissolved in a gel powder mix of 300 grams… this mixed with water, foods… less toxic to non-targeted “other” life. BobF>
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The new tank has cycled in two weeks and a variety of additional inhabitants have been added, the most interesting of which is a Bubble Tip Anemone (BTA). The tank contains the following species:
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This tank has seen quite a bit of evolution. At the moment, it is home to the Volitans Lion, Yellow Foxface Lo, a Powder Blue Tang, and – as of last night – a 12″ brittle star. We will see how these specimins fare as I slowly remove the coral to the larger tank.
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This is a 300 Gallon Display with a 40 Gallon Wet / Dry Sump, a chiller, 2 mini giant pumps featuring 6 powerheads and a closed loop system to ensure no dead spots.
It was initially picked up from ATM on Sunday, April 5, 2009. Less than a week later it appeared to have run its cycle and was ready for some livestock. A couple days later it appeared to enter another mini cycle. I have used a variety of bacteria products to hasten the nitrification cycle.
The lighting itself deserves some special attention:
Livestock to date
A bubble tip anemone has been reserved for the clown fish to host in once water quality has improved. In addition, I plan to add about 150 more lbs of live rock over time. I estimate it will take about a year to complete this tank but I am very much looking forward to the long term project. Many thanks to my good friend David for all his help getting this set up!
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The most interesting hitchhiker in this tank, to date, is the discovery of the Phyllodesmium magnum, an Aeolid Nudibranch with a taste for soft corals. Many thanks to LynnZ at wetwebmedia.com for helping me to positively id this creature. He was spotted crawling up the tank wall toward the overflow. He has not been seen again since. However, the nudi’s tend to take on the look of the coral they feed from. This one did a complete number on my Sinularia.
Although, this is a very interesting specimine, it is not one I would like to see cruising around my favorite corals. I will be removing it when I see it again!
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Over the course of the last week, I have added numerous coral additions to the 75 Gallon reef tank. These include candy cane, a flowerpot, frogspawn, pink plate coral, and sun polyps. See the pictures below!
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Last weekend, we introduced a beautiful Naso Tang into the tank. Although, he was shy for a couple of days, he quickly befriended the foxface. On Thursday, the Tang died. Necropsy showed that he had consumed sand and was unable to eliminate it. We will certainly be looking to replace this little fellow in the near future!
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Last weekend my friend David and I spent a great deal of time researching the best way to modify this 4-foot long tank for future marine use and accessability. It seemed the only way to move forward would be to drill holes for 2 bulkheads near the top and plumb in a wet dry filter that can later be converted to a refugium sump, if need be. So, the drilling began. Two drill bits and several hours later, the holes were completed and the tank was plumbed. In order to make up for head loss on the pump, we decided to power the return with a Mag 12. I also left a “t” in the line to accomodate a skimmer sometime in the near future. To top off the job, I painted the back of the tank using a black, water-based latex paint. Looks great! For now, the Koi are enjoying the revised home. However, I am a bit anxious to convert this to a saltwater unit sometime in the near future.
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I have completed the project to modify the wet/dry filter into a refugium. I cut 2 pieces of acryllin in order to create 2 additional bafflles. Then, I added 40 kbs of live sand and some live rock rubble to the refugium side, removed the drip tray and ran a piece of pvc with a filter sock. Finally, I topped it off with cheatomorpha algae and some basic lighting.
Future concerns will be to add some pods and reduce the flow as much as possible without affecting the skimmers functions. The same pump feeds both the inlet and the skimmer. So, I will keep this problem in mind for future designs.
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In an attempt to control algae in the display tank, and promote better natural biological filtration, I added 15 lbs of live rock to the tank and moved around some of the coral. This change was made during an adaptation from using a wet/dry to building out a refugium.
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March 12, 2009 I added an additional 15 lbs of live rock to the tank and moved some of the rubble to my refugium project on the 75 G tank.
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March 7, 2009 we added a Christmas Rock. I have counted at least 25 tiny feather dusters popping in and out of this rock.
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March 7, 2009 we added a Volitans Lionfish to this 75G tank. We had to wait almost a week to bring him home as he was being weaned from live food and I wanted to see him eat frozen krill or silversides, with my own eyes, before adding him to this tank. The lion has taken to eating frozen food quite well and is in the process of acclimating to the new environment and making friends with foxy, the foxface rabbit fish
In addition to the lion, we added a polyp rock with blue Sponge, some hairy mushrooms, daisy polyps, and a blue rose coral.
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I have moved ten of the smaller koi from this tank to the office pond. Then, I proceeded to move the 4 larger koi from the smaller tank into this tank in order to begin the saltwater conversion on my smaller tank (see category 85 Gallon Reef). Having different sized koi in this tank gives it more dimension. This transition also consisted of a water change of about 50 gallons (33%) and a thorough filter cleaning. Post cleaning test showed no readable levels of ammonia or nitrite. Current Stocking consists of: 24 Koi and 2 Plecos.
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The reef tank is continuing to grow. This weekend welcomed the addition of some more crabs and snails for the clean up crew. But, the exciting part is the addition of a very small Rose Goby, a Pearly Jawfish, a Red Mushroom Anemone, Green Brain, Sinularia, and Star Polyps. We have also realized that there is a Basket Star living in the Favia. The marine tank is quickly become the most interesting ecosystem under my care.
Despite perfect test parameters, I also completed a 10% water change. It was not nearly as difficult as I feared saltwater would be. The pictures below showcase the new additions of this weekend.
Continue reading…
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Today, we added a sand shifting star, 4 turbo snails, and a feather duster.
Check out these pictures!
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Just a quick word to the wise … A tank filled with 3 inch koi do not respond well to African Dwarf Frogs! Although, the koi certainly did not mind.
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Despite less than perfect water test reading over the last three weeks, today Brandon and I set out to ATM of Las Vegas to bring a water sample to Jacque. We were both ecstatic to find out that the tank had cycled and it was a good time to hire some additional members of the cleaning crew and bring home Nemo, who was on hold for over a month. In addition to Nemo, Brandon and I picked out about 8 more small pieces of live rock to add to the reef system. We also fell in love with two types of coral, a Favia (Closed Brain Coral) and 2 small pieces of Mushroom Coral (purple / blue).
Continue reading…
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Yesterday, I was a bit unhappy to learn that the tank is still reading ammonia. The algae was also back. So, I wiped the tank clean again and began catching algae with a piece of filter cloth. In addition, I added some bacteria and another 10 pounds of live sand. I also hired a cleaning crew to assist with the algae growth. The crew consists of 3 hermit crabs about the size of a penny. I look forward to testing the water again in 24 hours and seeing the nitrification process jump started.
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Since my last post on this tank, nearly 10 days ago, I have been fearful of a high ammonia or nitrite reading again. However, the tank is beginning to mature well. Today, I cleaned the canister filter and vacuumed 20 gallons from the rock at the bottom of the tank. Anyone who has kept koi in a tank knows that rock is not the best idea in the world. However, the fish seemed to enjoy the cleaner water and are continuing to thrive. Of course, these koi are not growing as fast as the koi in the office pond. The koi in this tank are fed only once per day, on average, because I am not home often enough to feed them more regularly and the kids cannot reach the opening at the top of the tank. Slow growth is quite acceptable; however, as I have not done much with my plans for the outdoor pond in which they will live out their adult years.
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Today’s pond maintenance consisted of a complete cleaning of the Fluval FX5 and a thorough examination of all 17 fish. Although, the filter was loaded with detritus, the water still tested at zero for ammonia, nitrite, and at a low 5 for nitrates. The addition of a timer for the lamp allows more daylight hours and the algae is doing its work on clearing the water of nitrate. In addition, the freshwater hydrometer showed no readings of salt in the water. So, the plants in the office will be happy as well. The 15 koi are thriving and eating 3-4 times each day. The two remaining feeder fish are now 2 inches long and growing. These may very well end up being the largest 12 cent feeders that Wal Mart has ever turned out.
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Another enlightening month of Leadership Las Vegas has opened my eyes to a few things that I believe everyone in the Southern Nevada community should be made aware of. Everyone seems to have an opinion on education. However, few people have the opportunity to view it from the inside out. That is exactly what Leadership Las Vegas Class of 2009 spent the month of January doing.
On the evening news we hear of sub-standard test data and other negative outcomes while school administrators and teachers struggle to meet the requirements of the infamous No Child Left Behind legislation. Very rarely do we hear of all the excellent programs provided by the Clark County School District (CCSD). Now, the problems are compounded by current financial crisis. Now, more than ever, the future of Nevada depend on public support.
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Las Vegas Mayor Oscar Goodman invited the Leadership Las Vegas Class of 2009 to his office on Friday for an informal introduction to the Office of the Mayor. The experience was great. Mayor Goodman was, as always, extremely cordial and answered all of the questions we had for him.
Mayor Goodman spent most of the allotted time addressing what he called the “fight of the city’s life.” For over a decade, Goodman has worked tirelessly toward his vision of a redeveloped and revitalized downtown. Economic ups and downs have created some delay. However, there has never before been an obstruction to these efforts as dark and deceptive as recent efforts put forth by the Culinary Union. Culinary Local 226 may actually have blown enough smoke to create a problem for the City Council. But, are citizens so blind as to sign petitions without knowing the implications?
Continue reading…
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Sometime between day 7 and 9 an algae bloom of brown, hairy algae has overtaken the live rock, live sand, and started attaching itself to the acrylic tank itself. In less than 24 hours, the unsightly stuff has completely overtaken the gorgeous Coraline Algae and left the uninhabited tank in an ugly mess. As if that isn’t frustrating enough, the water tests are still reading ammonia and no nitrites. Obviously, the nitrates are there or there would be no algae at all. So, it appears that nature has a different idea for this particular ecosystem.
In an effort to eliminate some of this brown, hairy, ugly mess, I have added a thin sheet of filter pad above the filter and rubbed the algae from the sides of the tank, the rock, and the sand. The filter pad has caught a great deal but I have a feeling I will have to do this a few days in a row. The bright side is that the salinity is finally correct. I will be adding some additional bacteria additive tomorrow in an effort to hasten the cycling of ammonia to nitrite.
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This 8 inch algae eater was added to the tank exactly a week ago. It has done a terrific job in cleaning the tank. This tank is now inhabited by the 4 koi mentioned in previous posts and this very large housekeeper.
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The 150 Gallon acryllic tank is now home to 31 assorted Koi and one fairly large algae eater. All of the fish are happy as they have shifted from one meal per day to 2 or 3. The additional meals are courtesy of the nitrifying bacteria that has finally taken hold. This is the quickest we have had a tank complete the nitrification cycle. It has taken approximately 5 weeks of almost daily water changes and the addition of live bacteria starter. I am crediting the rapid cycle to the consistent flow of the Fluval FX5 canister filter and the addition of bacteria. Needless to say, the fish are certainly happy!
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Despite the growth of a velvet looking Coraline algae, we were a bit disappointed to learn that the tank was not ready to add additional lifeforms. In addition to being a bit over-salted, there was a substantial reading of ammonia. Therefore, we replaced 4 gallons of the saltwater with RO filtered water and are forced to leave it for a few more days. It is noteworthy to point out; however, that the type of algae in this marine tank is actually attractive and many different colors. This is quite a dramatic change from the plant life we see form in the freshwater tanks.
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In December, 2008, Kevin purchased this acryllic tank from ATM of Las Vegas. It is currently a temporary home for 31 various Koi and one housekeeper, an algae eater, of course. This tank is filtered with the Fluval FX5 and an abundance of bio balls. It is currently undergoing week 5 of a strenuous cycling process and the fish have been salted to .03 in an effort to mitigate the effects of nitrite spikes and stress from almost daily 100 gallon water changes.
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This tank was purchased from Acrylic Tank Manufacturers in October of 2008 for use as a quarantine tank to observe and treat some of the Koi from the office pond that made it through the cycling nightmare of nitrite poisoning. Initially, the setup was plumbed by LeMar. The design was a catastrophe waiting to happen and I would not wish this type of plumbing on my worst enemy. The cabinet houses a 15 gallon wet / dry filter and is plumbed with a built in overflow, drainage with a ball valve and union, and a check valve from the pump back into the tank. This plumbing was the result of a great deal of trial and error … and one power outage that resulted in back flow; hence, the one-way check valve from the pump back to the tank. Seasoned tank owners know this is a mistake that is only made once. The check valve prohibits the backflow of water from the line into the tank once a siphon is created and the pump loses power. The $1.89 investment saves a mess.
Initially, the tank was home to 2 koi. Pippi was a very small (1 inch) becko who coexisted with a 3 inch platimum Ogon. Both of the koi had suffered a tremendous amount of internal damage and gill damage from the effects of new tank syndrome from the office pond. In mid-November, Pippi expired. In an effort to provide companionship for the platinum Ogon, I added four additional 3 inch koi to the mix.
The ensuing 2 months was an absolute nightmare in the world of fish husbandry. Despite numerous attempts to isolate the sick Ogon, treatments with salt to .03, Pimafix, Melafix, and nursery boxes to sustain a calm environment, this ill fish finally expired. The last of the initial office gang.
Despite the use of bacteria additives, the tank required water changes to almost 60% several times each week in order to combat nitrite readings sometimes in excess of 1.0. However, during this period, the 4 fish enjoyed meals of pellets, peas, shrimp, and oatmeal. They thrived and continued to grow.
On January 14, 2009, the water tested no detectable ammonia, nitrites, and low nitrates. Finally, victory in tank 2! The nitrite cycle has completed and the feeding frenzy is on! Now, the next plan is to add a pleco for some basic housekeeping.
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If you are a teacher or a home school parent …
This is the perfect site for parents, students, and teachers who are trying to develop or implement K-12 curriculum with budgetary concerns in this economy. I would suggest that any of my readers who have not tried www.helpme2teach.com go immediately to the site and give it a try! The site was developed by a teacher with over 40 years of classroom experience. She has hand-selected the sites and categorized them by subject matter. Did I mention this endorsement is for my mom? Regardless, it is an invaluable tool used by hundreds of teachers, homeschool parents, and even students who need additional explanations of concepts they just don’t get from their textbook.
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The kids had quite more than they bargained for the week before winter break. Christiana was determined to taste snow. Clark County School District actually canceled classes the next day in anticipation of even more snow. But, for Christiana, one taste was all she got. Brandon, of course, had a ball chasing anyone that would follow him outside. He saw the opportunity to make snow bombs and he took full advantage of it. Ariel was amused. However, her main concern was to not fall prey to Brandon’s ambitions. Overall, it was an exciting start to the winter holiday season. Even I was able to take several hours off work to enjoy the children in this most rare occurrence.
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This is a picture of how the office pond looks now, with 15 Koi and 2 feeders that made it through a lengthy nitrification process. Initially set-up in September with a Fluval 400, the filter was upgraded in October after additional Koi were added. Unfortunately, the pond inhabitants suffered a great deal during the nitrification cycle and the initial 13 fingerlings, one Platinum Ogon, and a 6-inch Gin Rin Yamabuke Ogon were lost. At that point, a 95% water change was conducted and the filter was cleaned. I added 30 feeders for about 2 weeks while the pond completed its cycle. 15 3-inch koi were acclimated about a month ago and the water quality tests perfect every day. These fish eat well, 2-4 times each day and are thriving.
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